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Russia looks at Pakistan with new eyes

Indrani Bagchi,  22 June 2009, 09:27 PM IST

A week ago, a visit by Pervez Musharraf, former Pakistan president, to Russia alerted Indian authorities. The visit was facilitated by a private businessman, but India realized quite soon that Musharraf was doing some facilitation of his own, preparing the way for the visit of Pakistan army chief, Ashfaque Kayani today. Musharraf, who remains very much a part of Pakistan’s military establishment reportedly had a very “productive” meeting with Russian prime minister Vladimir Putin.


The upshot of that meeting seems to be that Russia is willing to take another look at a defence relationship with Pakistan. Kayani went off on a short visit to Russia today, where he is to meet defence and foreign ministers and the army chief. The key question is, can this be the turning point in Russia’s defence relationship with Pakistan? If Russia starts selling arms to Pakistan, it will actually be a huge turnaround – in all these decades, Russia is probably the only country that did not sell weapons to Pakistan as India’s chief supplier. Pakistan, though, sourced a lot of Russian-made stuff from Ukraine.


Russia also had historical issues with Pakistan. When the Soviet Union withdrew from Afghanistan in 1989, the defeat was not so much at the hands of the Americans as the Pakistanis. That rankled for a long time. But in recent years, India has been shopping elsewhere for weapons.


Russia is now in the company of the Israelis, French and American weapons suppliers. Besides, New Delhi has now had persistent issues with big ticket acquisitions from Russia. So Russia could be feeling liberated from being a one-woman man with India. In fact, Indian officials have registered that Putin certainly feels there could be a commercial defence relationship with Pakistan. Russia’s other big client is China, and right now, China is also in the business of helping out Pakistan against the Taliban and the target of US calls to “stabilize” Pakistan.


In the meantime, Russia’s near abroad is in danger again, from Islamist militant groups in the Fergana valley (despite Islam Karimov, Uzbekistan cannot get a handle on the IMU, and Uzbek militants have been showing up in Pakistan, fighting alongside the Taliban). The argument therefore, is Pakistan needs to be assisted and supported in its fight against the Taliban because the scourge needs to be tackled in the central Asian states. Given this backdrop, Dmitry Medvedev’s meeting with Asif Ali Zardari in Yekaterinburg during the SCO summit was significant. According to reports, Medvedev promised wholehearted support to Pakistan in its military operation.


The Indian government will be watching very carefully to see what kind of defence supplies end up in Pakistan from Russia. But also what it portends for India’s oldest diplomatic friendship.

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Sameer says:

June 22,2009 at 10:27 PM IST

America will remain the major defense supplier for pakistan. Pakistan have this oppertunity to acquire weapons from all sources including Russia till the Surge continue to Push Taliban back. Its a myth that how long America is committed to fund and Aid Pakistan to do it? Again Americans have so much influence in pakistan that they can ask pakistan government not to purchase weapons from the Russians. I think Indian government should concentrate on development rather than these defence meetings since pakistan is so screwed up right now? Oh did I forget to mension that Americans will try to sell Similar or better weapons to india if any deal goes through between pakistan and Russia. This is their so called Defense business in the name of balance of Power which ruined asia for the past couple of decades!!!

 

Sunny says:

June 23,2009 at 02:29 AM IST

What if Russia supplies anything to Pakistan? It's shameful that on one hand the President keeps asking for aid from the world and on the other hand the military chief looks for the defense deals.
And why should India be worried about anything if it can make its defense so strong that anyone should think twice before casting an evil eye on it.
Had Pakistan spent the money that it had been spending on missiles and bombs on the development projects, a common Pakistani would have been very happy today rather than waiting for food in the refugee camps. Maybe the leaders want to give him a bomb/gun when he is hungry.
May the God(whoever it is) help the innocent civilians.

 

Mani says:

June 23,2009 at 04:47 AM IST

Pakistan is using American donated $$ to buy Russian weapons to supply Taliban and LeT to fight India. Sponsor of true international terrorism, eh?

 

Prabhakar says:

June 23,2009 at 05:33 AM IST

We live in world where the top most priority is "self", be it a individual, family, society or country. Russia or for that sake any country will sell arms or any thing else as long as it makes an economical sense. India is buying from others, as long as it does not affect supply from Russia is good but if it affects then...
However it is not possible to know exactly or control what others will do but surely we control what we do. I am sure authorities in India keeping a watch and deciding - what we need to do to take care of our interests.

 

Rahul says:

June 23,2009 at 09:17 AM IST

India should not be worried about Russia and Pakistan defence relationship. Its time for india to move on and grow up.

 

Salman gilani says:

June 23,2009 at 10:32 AM IST

Dear Indians,
I am a Paki and a regular reader of times of india. I want to highlight a fact that most of the time media in both our countries are giving tremendously biased pictures, analyses and perspectives. Couple that with our instinctive love for our countries, we mostly tend to make biased pictures of the situation. The bottomline is, establishment of both the countries are ruining one another at the cost of common men. We have a lot of poverty here in pakistan and the same holds true for india too. But both of india and pakistan also have nukes, missiles, and other WMDs. we are in a very deadly race. My dear indians, I know it would be hard for you to believe but i assure you, the indian authorities are very vigilently, intelligently, and ruthlessly killing innocents through their proxy war through the so called Taliban. Gorkha fighters have been physically found in pakistani territory. I know it will be hard to believe but its a reality. By stating this, i do not intend to imply that Pakistani authorities are innocent they might also be involved in similar acts, but this time, indian establishment is at an unprecedented offensive against pakistan. Also want to clarify that Pakistanis felt really bad about what happened in Mumbai Last year. It was horrible to see those images, the Pakistani public did not feel good about it. Any how, i pray that both the countries and their govts start seriously thinking about betterment of the masses. Chakde India & Pakistan

 

Alefiya says:

June 23,2009 at 12:49 PM IST

Now that's another nightmare for the Indian Government.Pakistan is no less than a beggar. I mean, can someone ask Zardari, Musharraf and Kiyani, whether they have something self-respect or not?! May be they don't, but i am sure atleast the pakistani people do have some! Honestly, I don't know what to say, it's like more or less we indians are used to such acts of the Military and the Govt. of Pakistan. No use banging our heads to walls!

 

vivek says:

June 23,2009 at 01:22 PM IST

keeping Track of developments nextdoor is one thing but India should not become pakistan centric. It is their problem if pakis want to destroy their hard earned money in hands of international arms suppliers. In present scenario, given the nukes both have, outright war is a remote possibility. Future is of economic might. Let's concentrate on other challenges facing us.

 

vijay, Chennai says:

June 23,2009 at 02:30 PM IST

*Salman gilani

- You guys speak like as if you are the angels of peace. Then how come a devil like ajmal kasab and a dozen others have been sent to kill innocent people of india(190) and ruin their lives and their families for ever.
This is the fact - All muslims are not terrorists, but all terrorists are muslims just because most of you are intolerant and want your religion to be ruling the world and want the rest to perish or be converted.
You want India and the western countries to be secular but at the same time you will not let any other religion to enter UAE, Jordan, Saudi, Qatar, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Kuwait, Iran, Iraq, Bahrainetc.
I can proudly say that in my country India, Mosques perform their prayers loudly five times a day without any interruptions and the same is allowed for all the other religions in this country. But can any of the Muslim countries of the middle east say that they will allow the rituals of the other religions to be performed in your streets. Why wouldnt you let Temples and Churches be built in the muslim countries but yet you want secularism to prevail in France.

The reason is very simple - The people of India are more tolerant when it comes to acceptance and accomodation of others sentiments. This tolerance is what is needed to stop terrorism and your funds and arms collected from US and China are in no way going to help you in dealing the terrorism.

 

Gilliana says:

June 23,2009 at 03:20 PM IST

I very much agree with Vivek. Let the Pakistanis do what they want and never allow this to bother progress. India must concentrate on its economy and become a world economic powerhouse.The rest will follow. What Pakistan is doing is part of the Islamic ethic where for ages the followers of Islam have never sought peace and prosperity or accomodated the goodwill of others. All they did was to kill and conquer, the focus being to convert others - all in the name of Allah. History proves this.

 

Ashish Gavande says:

June 23,2009 at 03:30 PM IST

I don’t think it is surprising that Russia will have defense arrangements with Pakistan considering the increasingly nationalist leadership in Russia. Also considering that India now has defense suppliers other than Russia it is fair that Russia keeps an open mind; after all its billions of dollars of American aid we are talking about. However, my concern is for the Pakistan government.
India too is involved in defense deals with Russia and picture is terrible. The cost of retrofitting of aircraft carrier “Admiral Gorshkov” has increased manifold and may cost India four times of the initial understanding. Even the “Akula” class submarines have their problems with recent fire and their delivery is delayed. Most of the recent fighter plane deals which India made were in open markets which were snatched by France, Israel, US etc. Russia planes were also part of the competition but failed against their European and American counterparts because of lower standards. Also Russia is increasingly pressuring its partners for more money as in gas deal with Ukraine.
Having said so India should have an eye on this “meetings” to be always prepared for any eventualities.

 

A.R.Dolas says:

June 23,2009 at 03:37 PM IST

All the powerful nations who consider themselves as the gaurdians of the human race are hypocrites.All the moves that are being made in the name of peace and anti terror activities have someway or the other linked to satisfy their own means at the behest of the troubled nations.At the end we see the outcome in terms of profits gained. Weaponary has become a main domain in the field of business and economy for most of the countries which is in recent past have promoted the sales of weapons in the name of peace.The road is endless and the results are uncertain.

 

Zafar Akhtar says:

June 23,2009 at 04:02 PM IST

Gentlemen,i am quite amazed to note that why indian are so much pakistan centric.In pakistan, offcourse people enjoy bollywood and thats about it.The media, tv and print do not discuss india at all because people are not interested.wheather india purchase weapons from israel,usa etc, is of no interest.
Now lets dicuss the terrosism.People in india should analyse the root cause of this in india.
In pakistan, it is clear that violence and terrosism is due to pakistani govt supporting usa.In india the problem is due to unresolved issues between india and pakistan like kashmir,hyderabad,junagurdh etc.Unless kashmir issue is resolved in accordance with the wishes of the kashmiri people, india will continue to bleed and would not be able to achieve their global ambitions.although pakistan is a small country compared to india but its army gives nightmares to the indian army.
Lets be reasonable and realistic.Lets try to resolve issues and dont interfere in each other countries.
pakistan is a very resilient country.the current problem will disappear in no time if we select the right leadership in the country.
if you recollect ten years back pakistan had four world cups in their pocket at the same time(cricket, hockey,squash and snooker).A country like this cannot be pushed.
Lets try to cultivate friendship between our countries on equal footings and i think media in both the countries have to play their positive role

 

nikhil says:

June 23,2009 at 04:17 PM IST

As Sir Wilson Churchill said, 'History of human kind is War,' so the war continues in different forms, open, proxy, cold, diplomatic.. so we have no option to fight, and as said in mahabharata, we should be ever vigilant, and be the mighty armed! India has moved on from being Russia centric for requirements, but India-Russia relation is one of the most tried and trusted diplomatic relation among Independent nations. Let us hope the relation remains!

 

rauf razzaq says:

June 23,2009 at 04:26 PM IST

Well if Pakistan is seeking support from Russia no matter either military or just moral but why Indians are so worried about that as they have relied on Russian military aid and assistance for so many years.??????

 

Pawan says:

June 23,2009 at 04:30 PM IST

oh yes u r right

 

baseer says:

June 23,2009 at 05:14 PM IST

Really disgusting why Indian are so much in Pak business? Indian and Isreals are using KGB’s network to destabilize Pak in Baluchistan and FATA, Pak want Russian help to eliminate that elements thats the whole story , the 2nd thing Pak is now serious to elements these bad guys n soon you will see the result.

 

Imran Malik says:

June 23,2009 at 05:24 PM IST

I agree with Mr. Zafar Akhtar that we should be realistic. Most of the commentators are biased and don't have enough knowledge of history and current happenings. is India not buying weapons from all over the world. India has less fear being attacked by any country but Pakistan has being a small country comparing to India. Let's not forget that India is going to increase its defence budget by 35% which is more than the whole defence budget of Pakistan. Indians have Pak fobia. they should concentrate on their problems and focus on their prosperity. Yes we allow minorities to live freely according to their religion and beleif. you can't give any example that Pakistanis have bothered minorities in the country. On the other hand, what Indians did with Muslims in Gujrat and Hyderabad. who can forget Babri Mosque. Who can forget Sikhs massacre and Golden Temple. I think Indians can easily. Moreover Pakistan is not buying weapons from so called US aid. Don't forget that Pakistan has lost billions due to unrest in the country. it is a loss of more than 40 billion dollars and US gave only 11 billion dollar. our economy crashed and we had to go to IMF. we don't need substadard weapons from Russia. I dont think Mr. Gillani as Pakistani. We sacrified more than any nation in the world in the name of socalled fight agaist terrosrism. these all terrorists and Al-qaida are American agents. We will eliminate them from our country very soon Insha Allah

 

Amitava,Kolkata says:

June 23,2009 at 05:34 PM IST

Reality is that Pakistani Govt/ Administration/ Militarys congenital disease is to do harm to India anyhow. They are more focussed on how to attack/infiltrate/bleed/destabilise India rather than poverty, misery, human rights of its own citizens. It is the American wealth/aid that is feeding Pak, thats why govt/adm/mil fights/ pretends to fight taliban/islamic terrorism but rather uses their fund to sponsor Terrorists/Anti India activities in backend. It is not strange , Pak will use Obamas donation in any possible weapon deal with any nation & utilize that against India. We cannot criticise Russia also as India is negotiating with US/Israel/EU for weapons, its fare enough they wil also keep all roads open to retain their weapon market. Only sensible thing International Community can do stop all weapon deal with Pak. they are saying Pak is "epicentre of terrorism" & helping them in buying arms and sponsoring terror in other hand. if they are so committed to global peace/ security, why cant they impose a sanction/ban on any weapon deal with Pak.Is money is more dearer than life/property of their own citizen?

 

salman gilani says:

June 23,2009 at 05:51 PM IST

Dear Vijay,

I can understand your feeling my dear vijay. But wanted to clarify some of your stereotypical comments about muslims. All muslims are not terrorists, totally wrong. Parbharkaran of LTTE was not a muslim, Irish Republican Army is not muslim, Basque movement in spain does not comprise muslim, the greatest terrorist of all, Adolf Hitler was not a muslim. Dear vijay, again as i said, its the media that teaches us to hate our neighbours. The acts of ten mumbai terrorist can not be labeled on the 6th largest nation of the world, i.e. Pakistan. Pakistani public is peaceful.

Regarding religious tolerance in india, i would beg to differ with you. I agree a great majority of india might be tolerant, but then we have horrible examples like gujrat violence, motivated totally by religious discrimination, i still readabout curfews in Lucknow, I still read about known figures like Shabana Azmi not being able to buy property in mumbai for the reason of being muslim. I would not discuss kashmir as its a known stigma on the secularist philosphy of india and endorsed by international agencies like amnesty international. I admire your luv for your country, which indeed is a great country, but you must admit, its far far far from perfect. We both must try to learn from our past mistakes and assume a reconciliatory approach. Take care my friend.

 

nas says:

June 23,2009 at 06:12 PM IST

India and its western ally spatially UK and USA should open their eyes now it was them who supported MUSHARRAF hole heartedly since he took over by a coupe , Musharraf and co never been sincere to western world instead of supporting dictators the should support politicians

 

Shayar Singh Rathore says:

June 23,2009 at 06:23 PM IST

No worries for India. India needs to improve its defence, economy and internal security services. Pakistan is nothing before India. See the past. Now it might possible that Russia is looking for somone who can purchase their weapons. Let Russia and Pakistan do their business.

 

Satnam says:

June 23,2009 at 06:53 PM IST

This country called pakistan is a curse for mankind.From a terrorist country to an extortionist country.Welfare of pakistani public was never on the agenda of pakistan govt -wether miltary or civilain.All the time they are so happy to tell the world how many problems they have and why th world should help them.It is almost 5 years since i heard anything about any thing like economy, education or exports. All i hear is blasts,kidanppings, drone attacks, suicide attacks. It is a sad scenario. It looks as if these pakistanis just dont know how to live in 21st century and they are mad at everyone.

 

Rattan Lall says:

June 23,2009 at 07:04 PM IST

Very intresting topic but i feel Russia or USA does not matter.At the bottom of all lies the religion.The root cause of all the problems is that Islam is not ready to accept any other religion/faith as valid.No matter what india does or what it does,nt do It will always be on the hit list of the Mullahs and Miltary that rules Pakistan.We as indians are enemies just because we dont believe in what they believe in.If they can not tolerate even the statues of BUddha in Afganistan than remember how difficult it is for thover 800 million hindus who are percieved as idol worshippers.kashmir id just an outlet.Give concessions on Kashmir and another jehad will be unleashed agianst india for liberation of muslims.It is indeed a very serious situation.

 

Ravi says:

June 23,2009 at 07:11 PM IST

Why no country is helping them with opening of say 1000 schools which give modern education.Till sometime back these Pakistanis were thumping thier chests there are no terrosits in pakistan froom where so many of them cropped up overnight ?They are using every weopon available to them except chinese nuclear bomb and north korean missiles.Why this country is always asking for wepaons all the time and at same time threatening the world that there could be no peace in South Asia till kashmir is handed over to them.

 

Prithvi says:

June 23,2009 at 07:48 PM IST

Yes Mr.Malik and Mr.Akhtar.We are Pakistan centric.The cause is very simple.We are cautious of the devil.Had Pakistan been a civilized country there would have been no cause for concerns.

 

N.Jiang says:

June 23,2009 at 07:58 PM IST

Zafar Akthar says, "although pakistan is a small country compared to india but its army gives nightmares to the indian army" - is a big joke. Pakistan military establishment is rogue and not deciplined. It has illicit understanding with terror groups including Al Qaida and Taliban. What you sow, you reap. Pakistan sows terrorism in others soil, but harvests in its own territory. A day will come, Paki army will handover all nukes to Taliban and Al Qaida.

 

Sunny says:

June 24,2009 at 01:00 AM IST

People who talk about injustice done to Junagarh,Hyderabad etc., should first talk about what they did to Bangladesh which was part of their country? Why were millions massacared by their so called great Army? How was their Army different from the present day Taliban killing innocents? They should know the facts first and then talk about the injustice. Moreover, Muslims are known to be intolerant. If they were unhappy with India, then you wouldn't find so many millions of Muslims living in this country. Muslims in this country know(though not admit openly) this is a much better place than living in Pakistan. If religion is the only thing that binds people then there wouldn't be so many Muslim countries in this world. They all could form a single nation. Whatever unity that they talk about is all sham.

 

Guptan Veemboor says:

June 24,2009 at 02:28 AM IST

Russia or rather the Soviet Union was the only country which has stood as a steadfast friend through thick and thin. Now its interest in our affairs has also waned and become more commercial. We have become a truly friendless nation in the whole world. We have never to fail system of making each and everyone our enemies.

 

AT says:

June 24,2009 at 03:26 AM IST

India should not be worried from country our neighbours are buying their weapons. The important thing to understand is, how they plan to integrate and use it in the overall scheme of things. Moreover, India needs to focus on its own indigenous defence research, technology and production, since that will provide India with a degree of weapons systems independence. This picture for me seems gloomy, to warrant a wider discussion. Especially singling out DRDO for its lack of research depth and quality that meets international standards. No surprise, India still doesn't have its own Chip Fabrication plant.

 

mookie bhakta says:

June 24,2009 at 05:19 AM IST

leave russa go.

 

BENGAL UNDER ATTACK says:

June 24,2009 at 11:58 AM IST

Of course, Russia will hinge its bets on Pakistan as India is not doing any decent job of eliminating the Taliban threat.

Russia's ambassador to NATO, Dmitry Rogozin, added from Brussels - "I can responsibly say that in the event of NATO's defeat in Afghanistan, fundamentalists who are inspired by this victory will set their eyes on the north. First they will hit Tajikistan, then they will try to break into Uzbekistan ... If things turn out badly, in about 10 years, our boys will have to fight well-armed and well-organized Islamists somewhere in Kazakhstan."

Last thing Russia wants is another fight with Islamists. It feels India is weak and cannot control the events in its neighbourhood. Better for Russia to directly engage with Pakistan, bury old hatchet and see how this Taliban menace can be stopped in its expansion up north.

All other events - freeing up of arms etc are incidental.

 

kamal says:

June 24,2009 at 12:12 PM IST

All of india's efforts should be to derail and destabalize Pakistan,
Why do you want an antagonistic state to grow strong anyway,

If this is out of some misplaced idealism then please abandon it.
Let pakistan Spend more and more on weapons and less on its people, Let its feudal Class and MILBUS grow in strength , thereby weakening its polity.We should Also launch ourselves into full military modernization and Stop taking half steps.

 

vijay says:

June 24,2009 at 02:34 PM IST

Mr. Salman Gilani,

Why is that Muslim countries wants all the countries to be democratic by allowing burqa etc. but they want to remain radical by not allowing other religions to be practised in their country? (By the way India allows women to wear a burqa but a saudi arabia will not let a hindu woman not to wear a burqa)

 

Rashmi R says:

June 24,2009 at 05:33 PM IST

If USA can go Pak friendly fearing India and its development,not surprised with Russia !

 

Hussain says:

June 24,2009 at 07:11 PM IST

Dear Mr. Salman Gilani....you missed one terrorist...Narindra Modi is also not Muslim!!!!
Bharteeee Bros....Let's try to live like a good neighbour! We will also then try to improve! HA!

 

PISSLAMABADY-MOOSH-LIMBIQ-LUNDS says:

June 24,2009 at 11:15 PM IST

ONLY ON COUNTRY OF THE WHOLE WORLD, THAT IS RUSSIA WHO KNOWS MOST TREACHEROUS IS UK BRITISH OF ANGLOSEXO KINDS WHICH SLIMES WITH PAKIKSATANS AND CHINASATAN IN THEIR COMMON BED DAY AND NIGHT WHICH ARE MASSPRODUCING DANGLO-SEXO-PAKO-CHINKO-SLIMY TERROR-BEASTS THAT ARE ABOUT CREATE NUCLEAR WAR IN FEBRUARY 2011 BY FIRSTLY NUCLEAR BOMBING THE INDIAN CITY OF BRENGLOAR

 

Sapper says:

June 25,2009 at 12:12 AM IST

There is no harm in this. Both Pakistan and Russia are independent and should be free to buy and sell whatever they want. What India needs to do is be aware of these relationships and focus on solving our own myriad problems.

It is only in this way that India will become a developed country for all its citizens.

 

Sapper says:

June 25,2009 at 01:26 AM IST

There is no harm in this. Both Pakistan and Russia are independent and should be free to buy and sell whatever they want. What India needs to do is be aware of these relationships and focus on solving our own myriad problems.

It is only in this way that India will become a developed country for all its citizens.

 

shaukat says:

June 25,2009 at 02:40 AM IST

you guys are all dead wrong.indian establishment is a very greedy one.one hand india declaire biggest democracy,other hand peoples in kashmir are not allowed to speak in open or express their opinions in public.indian establishmen is shame.
Enemy of india will distroy india completely by using pakistan and his nuclear bombs.
indias distany lye with pakistan.solve the problems with your neighbours and live in peace.

 

Zoheb says:

June 25,2009 at 11:42 AM IST

To Vijay, Chennai

It really surprise me that how biased and down market people like you can be. Look at the topic of the blog. Its about Russia-Pak relation. Not about religion. But fools like you always bring religion in to every damn discussion.

I am Indian muslim staying here in middle east. Here we have Mosques, Chaurches and temples. My hindu friends visit temples once every week. There is no restriction.

When you dont know the fact dont speak it. As for your comments "All muslims are not terrorists, but all terrorists are muslims". Salman Gilani has rightly pointed out few international groups. But lets see whats the picture in India. You must have read the recent article in TOI that says India has highest number of domestic terrorists groups. If you see the list out of 27 groups 5 are muslim organisations/groups. In other words 22 out of 27 are non-muslim groups. But people like you cannot see this fact. More people in India are killed by these 22 groups as compared to those 5 muslim terrorists groups. But people like you stay mum when any of those 22 groups attack.

 

Mohammed Kashif says:

June 25,2009 at 11:51 AM IST

There should be a final solution to the problem of Pakistan. India must realize that Pakistan is a failed state like and like a septic foot must be cut off to save ourself and the region.

America and China have their vested interest in keeping India engaged with Pakistan. They very well know that if India has full time with development activities, then it will be a superpower soon. Pakistan is just a pawn in their game to contain India.

Poor Pakistanis their foundation itself was flawed and their existence is a shamble. One strike and Pakistan will blow into pieces of pakhtunistan, Punjab, and Sindh. Lets do it.

 

AJ says:

June 25,2009 at 12:28 PM IST

Its interesting to read the comments given by the PAK Lovers,but i have a question to ask and it's to all of Pakistan.....I want to know what according to them is the solution for the Kashmir issue ?

When the fact is Pakistan can never have it and India will never Give it....

So what solution are we talking about ?

 

Jitesh says:

June 25,2009 at 12:39 PM IST

AS YOU SOW, SO WILL YOU REAP. If you sow a mango you wont reap a banana. If you sow terrorism, you wont reap the peace.
Pakistan has got curses from thousands and lacs of people. They would have to face the consequences of the same.

 

cheng says:

June 25,2009 at 12:49 PM IST

Since 47 Pak was occuppied & projecting hindu-
india in all forms media/education/milatarily as enemy and fought unwanted wars and got divided.
No real democracy exists in any muslim nations
nor any kind of tolerance.Religion & its brain-
washed system unite them and claim "suppressed"
for its own fault, and demand much more from others without introspection. Traveled all parts
of muslim countries Indian muslims enjoy the post
freedom, liberty, opportunity & development despite much population growth and poor education.
Union India is comprised different kingdoms and
its Pak-Afgan groups tried to conquer in 47.
Since 47 division it gained hindu extremeism in
2000 due to appeasement policy and muslim extremist growth.Pak is quite far from Indias
achievements & growth, or its free society, press.

 

Rai Rashid Mahmood Kharal says:

June 25,2009 at 12:51 PM IST

Indians are overly emotional. It is their habit to make mountain out of a molehill especially when it comes to Pakistan. They are very much Pakistani centric.Be clear my friends if you want peace and prosperity then you have to demonstrate it practically. On one hand Nehru Pleaded United Nations to push Pakistan for the ceasfire in Jammu and Kashmir and Promised in written that the issue of Kashmir will be resolved through a fair and free election under the united Nation. Where is that Promise.Who will fulfill that promise my dear indians. Indian Establishment is clever like a Fox and we know that.Indians Interference in East Pakistan its training to Mukti Bahni guerillas and attack on Siachen are prime examples.On one hand Kashimirs are living under fear of gunfire, curfews, gangrapes and injustice inflicted on them by the indian security forces for 60 years and on one India projects itself as a big Secular democracy. Kashmiries will never bow down to India.Pakistan wants peace with India but not on Indian terms. Pakistani Nation is a brave and vibrant. We know how to defend our country and how to deal with India.

 

Vivek says:

June 25,2009 at 12:54 PM IST

@ salman gilani :

"Parbharkaran of LTTE was not a muslim, Irish Republican Army is not muslim, Basque movement in spain does not comprise muslim, the greatest terrorist of all, Adolf Hitler was not a muslim"

Terrrorist is relative term ... for people native to such struggles, those leaders were nothing less than heroes but then numbers matters, they stood against majority. Then you mention :"Regarding religious tolerance in india, "

Violence against different people in india are due to a lot of reasons.....but let me try to address your concern....ie violence/prejudice against muslims.If you had ever read anything about hinduism then you'd accept the fact that it has thrived only because it has accpted reality at every stage whether aggression/conquest by other external kingdoms or ideas.It is this soft nature of open ended philosophy that many other culture and religions co-exist here in india.So why the violence/prejudice against muslims...thats because offlate the definitions/parameters of Hinduism seem to have lost its way (Refer : http://www.indiatogether.org/opinions/rbakshi/vanand/vanandII-p1.htm )as it tries to ignore the actual realty and tries to find the manliness within ...when britons and muslims of the pure (pakistan) mocks us of their dubious achievements (partition)....and go on to say words like "Today India is divided into 2 , now it'll dis-integrate into many" (by Jinnah) and many other short-sighted versions by other people.So a fundamentalists party is formed : BJP, biased by the streamlined RSS, coining term like Hindutva.

But then my friend even RSS has realized its not going to help them any further and the leadeship of RSS has abandoned the idea of Hindutva and concentrated on other things.

Lastly, remember its the aggressors who demanded a country for the pure and hence the backlashes which are still relevant in india,among many other things ....So we dont need a word on what to do and how to do it.Cause the wise always prevails....

 

Xitiz Aggarwal says:

June 25,2009 at 01:59 PM IST

This had to happen some day. With America having such a strong influence over Pakistan, Russia must have been exploring options to create a place for itself and there was no better way then this. This will serve a dual purpose for them, it will help them in establishing themselves in Pakistan and virtually fight against their long battle against the terror groups from the other side. Pakistan is in a win win situation in all terms, gaining support from all ends and keeping everyone interested. They have used these terror groups for all good till date and now with the international pressure to fight against terror they are again being benefited in all terms including monetory one's.
One major concern for India which has been unsaid so far is that Mr. pervez Mussharraf is still having a big influence in Pakistan's stratergies. This is something we need to look out for that what he believes and what are his real stratergies. He has done all he could to India during his term, his impressions in Kargil are still afresh in our memories. This is again a strategic move by him to gain support from Russia after being bullied by long partner america.

 

zubeenn says:

June 25,2009 at 04:48 PM IST

DEAR JAFAR AKHTAR
I AM REALLY AMAZED BY YOUR COMMENTS ABOUT INDIA'S PAK CENTRIC POLICIES.SEE WE ARE A PROGRESSIVE COUNTRY HAVING A GROWTH RATE OF NEARLY 7% EVEN IN THESE TIMES OF ECONOMIC GLOOM AND OUR IT SECTOR IS WORLDS BEST.IN TERMS OF POWER OUR DEFENCE ESTABLISHMENT HAS GOT HARDLY ANY PARALLELS WHICH DONT NEED TO BE EMPLIFIED UPON.A WAR IS FIRSTLY FOUGHT ON THE MIND AND SOUL WHICH WE CALL 'ZAZBA' & ACCORDING TO ME INDIAN ARMY DOSENT NEED ANY METHAPHORS.ITS HILARIOUS THAT AFTER ALL THESE YEARS POST 1971,KARGIL ETC STILL YOU FEEL THAT PAK ARMY GIVES NIGHTMARES TO US.THE FACT IS PAK ARMY DOSENT EVEN HAVE THE MORALITY TO EVEN RESPECT THE DEAD SOLDIERS AND EVEN DENIES AS BEING THEIR OWN..FOR ME THIS IS COWERDICE AT ITS BEST.ANYWAYS THESE EXAMPLES ARE RENOWNED WORLDWIDE..AT LEAST WE DONT BUY ARMS FROM ALMS..AND THATS NOT A STATEMENT..ITS A FACT. DONT YOU KNOW YOUR SO CALLED GOVT'S POLICIES. YOU CAN NEVER WIN INDIA NOR EVEN MATCH HER ECONOMICS.SO WHY COMMENT ABSURD THINGS.YOU TALK OF FRIENDSHIP AND STABS RIGHT AT THE BACK..YOUR GOVT, YOUR NATIONS POLICIES IS ONLY ENGAGING INDIA DIPLOMATICALLY,POLITICALLY,MILITARILY..BUT THE BOTTOMLINE IS..'YOU CANT'.
NO ONE FROM INDIA IS INTERESTED IN YOUR AFFAIRS & WE ARE HAPPY WITH OUR GROWTH AND PROSPERITY BUT YOU ARENT.AND THATS WHY TIME AND AGAIN YOU PEOPLE POKE YOUR NOSE INTO OWR AFFAIRS..DONT DO IT..ITS A DIRTY HABIT..HAVENT YOU ALL LEARNED THAT..PERHAPS YOU WILL NEVER LEARN.....

 

Sushil - Australia says:

June 25,2009 at 08:26 PM IST

Mr. Salman Gilani
As u himself agree, media of both sides turn the simple news into aggarvate-one on many times! Than how u come on conclution about proxy war by India in Pak. through Taliban!
Kindly let me whom's creation Taliban is? \, as per recent statement of Pak President Asif ali Zardari during visit of America.

 

Yash says:

June 25,2009 at 08:59 PM IST

Mr. Imran
May I say, sikhs r also Indians,and they constitutes as a part of Hinduism. Muslim of here r also Indian's, once Sir Sayeed Ahmedkhan called himself as Hindumuslim of India, during Brtish raj.
M. Jinah lived more time in India, than Pakistan, and, was active member of Indian Congress prior than Mahatma Gandhi. We all r burned off British politic.

 

Simon Mathews says:

June 26,2009 at 02:10 AM IST

Some of my Pakistani friends in here seem to say that the raison d'être for terror outfits like Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT) to attack India is the unresolved Kashmir issue . Is this the truth and does it have any basis? Lets discuss just one of the Pakistani terror outfits the Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT )
Lashker-e-Taiba, Lashkar-e-Toiba, or its other aliases means “the Army of the Pure” or “the Army of the Righteous”, was founded in 1993 by Sa’eed, the co-founder of the parent Markaz, to conduct jihad or holy war. LeT has itself declared that the jihadis are trained to engage in a “righteous” war and have been send not just to Kashmir but to nations like Afghanistan, Chechnya, Bosnia, the Philippines and Kosovo,. In a meeting in 1999, the LeT founder, Mohammed Sa’eed declared - . Today, I announce the break-up of India, insha-Allah. We will not rest until the whole India is dissolved into Pakistan … May Allah bestow martyrdom on us and enter us into the higher ranks of Paradise by His mercy. LeT’s stated aim is the destruction of India, among other nations and the creation of an Islamic Caliphate, wherever possible. So the argument that Pakistani terrorist are attacking India because of the unresolved Kashmir issue is baseless, off the mark and distortion of the truth, and a continuation of the lies and deceit of the Pakistani establishment.
Pakistanis need to look internally to see what is wrong with them as a country and why is that many nations in the world have imposed many restrictions on its citizens? It is pretty obvious to anyone with eyes to see, ears to hear and an open heart for the truth. You can either accept the truth, and work towards reversing the trend or you can, as in the past, continue to rave and rant about non issues and blame everyone else, be it Kashmir, America or Britain. Either way you will bear its consequences, good or bad.

 

mudassar says:

June 26,2009 at 04:16 PM IST

all who have written above are foolish every one here wants his opnion first but i will say before pointing aby one we should see our souls

 

Rahan Khan says:

June 27,2009 at 09:58 PM IST

Rai Rashid Mahmood Kharal

Rai Bhai, If Indians are overly emotional, then Pakistanis are overly childish and senseless. It is always Paki habit to make a volcano out of everything when it comes to India. They have no work, so obsessed are with INDIA and Kashmir that they will even forget to understand what their problem is. It is pure INDIA-centric which even a kid knows, and no wonder US President Barack Obama had to request their PM and Prez to shed their India-obsession and focus on the enemy within, But we all know that PAKI will never do that coz it is in their DNA to chant India and INDIA always. That is their mantra and national anthem. Pakistan is in a big mess today and it will remain that way for a very long time, battling Taliban for decades. It is only reaping what it sowed all these years. The devil has come to haunt its in its own backyard. The issue of JAMMU and Kashmir was resolved in 1947 itself when the then MAHARAJA HARI SINGH handed over the instrument of accession to INDIA. The matter thus was resolved then and there, it’s closed. Jammu & Kashmir has had several free and fair elections and the recent polls cocked a snook at the separatists call for a boycott. Even one of the sepetarist leader SAjid lone had to bite the dust at the poll hustings. That was the final slap on Pakistan’s childish and shameless call for KASHMIR. Simple, the Kashmiris know that only in India will they enjoy growth, prosperity and security. Not in PAK where they will be consumed by terror and violence.

Also, tell me how many how many free elections were held so far in Pakistan occupied KASHMIR? None, the people there live subjugated and live under army string tactics. Where is that tall promise of free elections there?

 

Rahan Khan says:

June 27,2009 at 10:00 PM IST

Rai Rashid Mahmood Kharal

Paki is a clever devil, playing games and indulging in duplicity talking of peace while indulging in shameful terror attacks on innocents. Perhaps that their culture.

INDIA interfered in East Pakistan coz it was forced to do so when the PAKI elements there then were causing nuisance as they always do and killing, raping scores of innocent Bengali Muslims. Even a kid in Alaska knows it

Kashimiris IN Pak occupied KASHMIR live under fear of gunfire, curfews, gang rapes and injustice inflicted on them by PAK security forces and rogue terror groups. ISN’T IT shameful?? All double talks

Pakistan projects itself as a modern vibrant Muslim nation, but pray where is it so?? It is lynched by violence, poverty, illiteracy and problems of all kinds. KashmirIs will never agree to merge with PAKISTAN for reasons already told here.

INDIA wants peace with India but each time it was back stabbed and this shows that how shameless you Pakis are. If Pak wants to peace, then it should shed its policies and behave like a responsible nation. And any peace will be only on INDIA’s terms and not coercion thr terror.

INDIA is a mighty country, proud, courageous, self-sufficient and vibrant that’s one of the world’s fastest growing economies. Ant mischief Pakistan indulges with us, it will be whipped and annihilated. SALAAM…..

 

Rahan Khan says:

June 28,2009 at 12:49 PM IST

Rai Rashid Mahmood Kharal

Rai Bhai, If Indians are overly emotional, then Pakistanis are overly childish and senseless. It is always Paki habit to make a volcano out of everything when it comes to India. They have no work, so obsessed are with INDIA and Kashmir that they will even forget to understand what their problem is. It is pure INDIA-centric which even a kid knows, and no wonder US President Barack Obama had to request their PM and Prez to shed their India-obsession and focus on the enemy within, But we all know that PAKI will never do that coz it is in their DNA to chant India and INDIA always. That is their mantra and national anthem. Pakistan is in a big mess today and it will remain that way for a very long time, battling Taliban for decades. It is only reaping what it sowed all these years. The devil has come to haunt its in its own backyard. The issue of JAMMU and Kashmir was resolved in 1947 itself when the then MAHARAJA HARI SINGH handed over the instrument of accession to INDIA. The matter thus was resolved then and there, it’s closed. Jammu & Kashmir has had several free and fair elections and the recent polls cocked a snook at the separatists call for a boycott. Even one of the sepetarist leader SAjid lone had to bite the dust at the poll hustings. That was the final slap on Pakistan’s childish and shameless call for KASHMIR. Simple, the Kashmiris know that only in India will they enjoy growth, prosperity and security. Not in PAK where they will be consumed by terror and violence.

Also, tell me how many how many free elections were held so far in Pakistan occupied KASHMIR? None, the people there live subjugated and live under army string tactics. Where is that tall promise of free elections there?

 

Rahan Khan says:

June 28,2009 at 12:50 PM IST

Rai Rashid Mahmood Kharal

Paki is a clever devil,a terrorist rogue (epicenter of terrorism) playing games and indulging in duplicity talking of peace while indulging in shameful terror attacks on innocents. Perhaps that their culture.

INDIA interfered in East Pakistan coz it was forced to do so when the PAKI elements there then were causing nuisance as they always do and killing, raping scores of innocent Bengali Muslims. Even a kid in Alaska knows it

Kashimirs IN Pak occupied KASHMIR live under fear of gunfire, curfews, gangrapes and injustice inflicted on them by PAK security forces and rogue terror groups. ISN’T IT shameful?? All double talks

Pakistan projects itself as a modern vibrant Muslim nation, but pray where is it so?? It is lynched by violence, poverty, illiteracy and problems of all kinds. Kashmiries will never agree to merge with PAKISTAN for reasons already told here.

INDIA wants peace with India but each time it was backstabbed and this shows that how shameless you Pakis are. If Pak wants to peace, then it should shed its policies and behave like a responsible nation. And any peace will be only on INDIA’s terms and not coercion thr terror.

INDIA is a mighty country, proud, courageous, self-sufficient and vibrant that’s one of the world’s fastest growing economies. Ant mischief Pakistan indulges with us, it will be whipped and annihilated. SALAAM…..

 

NR says:

June 28,2009 at 10:28 PM IST

RELATIONS WILL KEEP ON CHANGING SO AS FRIENDS AND FOES. INDIA SHOULD KEEP ITSELF STRONG WITHIN INSIDE OUT TO TEACH LESSON TO ANY BODY AT ANY TIME & AT ANY PLACE. INSTEAD OF PLANNING FOR DIFFERENT ENEMIES. BECAUSE IT IS RATHER EASY TO KEEP ONE PLAN OF KEEPING ITSELF SHIELDED AND HARD IF NEEDED, RATHER THAN THINKING OF 100 DIFFERENT PLANS FOR CHANGNING ENEMIES. CONCENTRATE ON GOAL.

 

amusedbypakistan says:

June 29,2009 at 02:22 AM IST

I have few questions for Pakistan (ignore all the india v/s pak debate)

a. When will you stop begging for help from the western world and learn to stand on your own feet? i.e by having world class institutions, focusing on healthcare, infrastructure, education, exploiting globalization benefits?

b. When will you stop acting barbaric and become civilized? When will you stop your hatred for the world and calm yourself and focus on your generation and your kid's prosperity and living life and enjoying it, instead of constantly fighting?

c. When will you make your country safe for daughters, tourists, cricketers and flourish in the hospitality industry?

d. When will you stop being rated as a third class state where no one would ever to choose to go on a holiday (if one is not from pakistan)?

 

Hassan says:

June 29,2009 at 09:07 PM IST

I think Ms. Indrani has some serious issues as Pakistan is he only focus of her blogs (80% of the time). I know that we share a love-hate relationship but it is time to stop the hatred and stop blaming others for your own shortcomings. This goes for both Pakistan and India. Every murder/killing that happens in India is not done by a Pakistani and every killing that happens in Pak is not done by an Indian. If India thinks that with their new found super power status they can bully Pakistan than they are wrong. By blocking cricket team visits and other cultural cooperations, India can't simply impose sanctions on Pakistan as they have no control over it. We all know that Mumbai tragedy was also a failure of Indian government that used it well to win the election in April.
Also, on "all terrorists being muslims" comments, last time I checked "Prabhakran" is not a muslim name and is of biggest terrorist who threatened Sri Lanka for years, so I suppose with that logic every tamil is a terrorist... give me a break!

 

joseph michael says:

July 01,2009 at 05:56 PM IST

Seems both Pakistan and Russia have realised that all eggs should not be put in one basket. When India turns more and more to America for its defence needs there is nothing wrong if Russia sells weapons to Pakistan. Seeing India as a better market U.S. is dumping Pakistan.

 

shalimarguru says:

July 04,2009 at 09:21 PM IST

I am pleased to learn Pervez Musharraf is positively active - he is a good man.

 

savantius says:

July 06,2009 at 06:43 PM IST

I think India should stop fighting for Kashmir...it belongs to them. I think India should fight to regain all of what is now called Pakistan because...it all belong to them .

 

wandemataram01 says:

July 09,2009 at 06:46 PM IST

I don't understand one thing,
--Highly qualified persons in INDIA is higher then other countries
--More no. of scientists are in INDIA then any other
Then what DRDO os doing why can we also devlop some good kind of weapons, we have capability ,we have lots of engineers passing out every year and they are joining IT instead to there own domain because of salary and good leaving, why can’t our govt provide provision and encourage people to work for government and join govt workforce
I am 200% sure we can make more good weapons, if Russia, Israel can make why we can’t.
Correct me if I am wrong , but as like china we need to be more self dependent we need to trust our own ability..we can make a change
Wandemataram...

 

Rao says:

July 26,2009 at 08:16 PM IST

Dear Mr. Vijay,
we are probably not the angle of peace but rest assure you are not either. All terrorist are Muslims,hmm, who was Bhaggat Singh?? two israeli prime ministers have been working with terrorist groups you want me to give you a list dont worry i will send it to you if you like. how many people died in mumbai 190, you know we have died in thousand by the hands of indian agent in FATA and Balochistan. Who did the 9/11, claimed Usama Bin Laden, may be it is right, but you know, how many have died in afghanistan. where are those WMDs, which was a claim to vague a war against iraq. israel killed thousands of innocent human beings in palistine, but who is collpurt Muslims. for you r information we have ruled india for more than 1000 years and still remained a hindu majority, we ruled spain for 700 years, but sitll remained christian majority as it should be. i am against all type of terrorism, that is initiated by a state or an individual group. lets be more realistic.

 

A Shrivastava says:

August 04,2009 at 07:16 PM IST

I just want to say that only Pakistan is helping the terrorist against the India to keep alive the fear of India, to draw the attention away from other major problems of the country, because the politician, and the government of Pakistan don't have the capacity to work for advancement of their country.

 

Dilse says:

August 08,2009 at 02:56 PM IST

Russia has no friends or enmies, it has timely comrades.

 

Fatima says:

October 24,2009 at 01:56 AM IST

Western countries considers asia as market specially southasia. Look at the africa,after making it dumping ground USA,UK,FRANCE & RUSSIA r set to destroy and earn money from asia and indian subcontinent. India is on path of development and economy is growing with high speed,so no need to waste indian people's money on weapons. But try to solve problems with pakis on diplomatic level. Indian officials and politicians have to make their mind like businessman like western countries do for the long term profit for their people and their country.

 

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ABOUT INDRANI BAGCHI More
Indrani Bagchi is The Times of India's diplomatic editor. She calls this blog a wide canvas through which she looks at the world and how India responds to it.
 
The views expressed in Globespotting are the author´s own.
 
 
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